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	<title>Comments on: Is Joe Johnson Worth A Max Deal?</title>
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		<title>By: Alex David, aka Short White Boy</title>
		<link>http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/2010/05/17/is-joe-johnson-worth-a-max-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-1003</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex David, aka Short White Boy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 23:52:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/?p=1015#comment-1003</guid>
		<description>Yeah, I agree that the worst-case scenario is overpaying for average/question-mark talent.  Or as I call it, The 2000s Knick Way.  So far Donnie Walsh has been smart enough to do that, even if it meant losing possible aging vets who he mildly pursued this past summer like Grant Hill and Jason Kidd.  As you say, the key is to leave future possibilities open.

In terms of Felton, he&#039;s an unrestricted free agent, so it&#039;s not really up to MJ -- it&#039;s just a straight-up bidding war.  Since Felton&#039;s not a max player, it&#039;s not like the home team even has a financial advantage.  They could&#039;ve signed him to a long-term deal last summer, but Larry Brown&#039;s supposedly had mixed feelings about him.  Although that may have changed &#039;cuz they traded away DJ Augustin and thus no longer even have a true backup PG, so now I imagine they&#039;ll be forced to pay him more than they wanted to last year.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, I agree that the worst-case scenario is overpaying for average/question-mark talent.  Or as I call it, The 2000s Knick Way.  So far Donnie Walsh has been smart enough to do that, even if it meant losing possible aging vets who he mildly pursued this past summer like Grant Hill and Jason Kidd.  As you say, the key is to leave future possibilities open.</p>
<p>In terms of Felton, he&#8217;s an unrestricted free agent, so it&#8217;s not really up to MJ &#8212; it&#8217;s just a straight-up bidding war.  Since Felton&#8217;s not a max player, it&#8217;s not like the home team even has a financial advantage.  They could&#8217;ve signed him to a long-term deal last summer, but Larry Brown&#8217;s supposedly had mixed feelings about him.  Although that may have changed &#8216;cuz they traded away DJ Augustin and thus no longer even have a true backup PG, so now I imagine they&#8217;ll be forced to pay him more than they wanted to last year.</p>
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		<title>By: Neil</title>
		<link>http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/2010/05/17/is-joe-johnson-worth-a-max-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-1001</link>
		<dc:creator>Neil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 19:35:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/?p=1015#comment-1001</guid>
		<description>Yeah, I&#039;m not sure how many more wins we&#039;ll have with Ray Allen, but my whole thinking is more towards an &quot;organic&quot; growth of the program, with Lee, Gallo, Chandler and Douglas as the tentative building blocks.
What I&#039;m afraid of is overpaying an above average talent, and sacrificing David Lee for a bunch of expensive question marks.

Also, I&#039;m not sure there are any point guards in this free-agency season that have a considerably greater upside than Douglas. Simply put, none of them represent such a significant upgrade that would worth 5-6 mill a year. 

I rather stick with Douglas (and his rookie contract), and either keep Duhon on the dirt-chip or get another point guard in the draft. I have my sight set on Gonzaga&#039;s Matt Boulding for three years now, I think he could be a really good point guard for us (though, admittedly, I think i&#039;m very much in a minority based on the mock drafts I&#039;ve been reading).
 
Regarding Felton, I find it hard to believe MJ will let his starting Tar Hill point guard go. They made the playoffs with him, why wouldn&#039;t they offer him at least the 6 mill he&#039;s currently making?

And yeah, though Lebron 2013 is not out of the question, the idea should indeed be that if we don&#039;t hit a home-run this summer we still leave ourselves the option to hit a home run sometimes in the future. I&#039;ve been a Knicks fan since 1985, I&#039;m not going anywhere.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, I&#8217;m not sure how many more wins we&#8217;ll have with Ray Allen, but my whole thinking is more towards an &#8220;organic&#8221; growth of the program, with Lee, Gallo, Chandler and Douglas as the tentative building blocks.<br />
What I&#8217;m afraid of is overpaying an above average talent, and sacrificing David Lee for a bunch of expensive question marks.</p>
<p>Also, I&#8217;m not sure there are any point guards in this free-agency season that have a considerably greater upside than Douglas. Simply put, none of them represent such a significant upgrade that would worth 5-6 mill a year. </p>
<p>I rather stick with Douglas (and his rookie contract), and either keep Duhon on the dirt-chip or get another point guard in the draft. I have my sight set on Gonzaga&#8217;s Matt Boulding for three years now, I think he could be a really good point guard for us (though, admittedly, I think i&#8217;m very much in a minority based on the mock drafts I&#8217;ve been reading).</p>
<p>Regarding Felton, I find it hard to believe MJ will let his starting Tar Hill point guard go. They made the playoffs with him, why wouldn&#8217;t they offer him at least the 6 mill he&#8217;s currently making?</p>
<p>And yeah, though Lebron 2013 is not out of the question, the idea should indeed be that if we don&#8217;t hit a home-run this summer we still leave ourselves the option to hit a home run sometimes in the future. I&#8217;ve been a Knicks fan since 1985, I&#8217;m not going anywhere.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex David, aka Short White Boy</title>
		<link>http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/2010/05/17/is-joe-johnson-worth-a-max-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-1000</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex David, aka Short White Boy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 19:10:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/?p=1015#comment-1000</guid>
		<description>Neil, I&#039;m with you that we might not get any max player, but I&#039;m not sure I agree with short-term vet idea.  Well, if Camby was still available, sure, &#039;cuz he&#039;s different in that he&#039;s a defensive player who can help teach your young &#039;uns while not taking away shots.  

However, if you go for a Ray Allen, you have to at least partly/occasionally focus your O on having him run around &amp; free himself up on picks for open shots.  I&#039;d rather those opportunities go to Gallo or Chandler.  Maybe Ray Ray would give us 10 extra wins, but does he help us create a better foundation?  You could argue that we need a winning mentality, and that if he brought that alone, it&#039;d be huge, but I want more.  

If we can&#039;t get the big guns, I&#039;d rather us go for smaller contracts where we can try out younger less established players like Ray Felton and Brendan Haywood.  If they can add say only 5 wins, but remain part of the future, I think it sets us up better.  And perhaps could make us a more appealing free agency destination for &#039;Melo next year, or I believe the year after CP3 becomes available.  Hell, in three years LeBron might become a free agent again, and if we&#039;ve got a decent non-aging core, maybe THEN he&#039;d come.

Yup, you heard it here first, start the campaign: LeBron in 2013.  He&#039;ll still only be 28 then.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neil, I&#8217;m with you that we might not get any max player, but I&#8217;m not sure I agree with short-term vet idea.  Well, if Camby was still available, sure, &#8216;cuz he&#8217;s different in that he&#8217;s a defensive player who can help teach your young &#8216;uns while not taking away shots.  </p>
<p>However, if you go for a Ray Allen, you have to at least partly/occasionally focus your O on having him run around &#038; free himself up on picks for open shots.  I&#8217;d rather those opportunities go to Gallo or Chandler.  Maybe Ray Ray would give us 10 extra wins, but does he help us create a better foundation?  You could argue that we need a winning mentality, and that if he brought that alone, it&#8217;d be huge, but I want more.  </p>
<p>If we can&#8217;t get the big guns, I&#8217;d rather us go for smaller contracts where we can try out younger less established players like Ray Felton and Brendan Haywood.  If they can add say only 5 wins, but remain part of the future, I think it sets us up better.  And perhaps could make us a more appealing free agency destination for &#8216;Melo next year, or I believe the year after CP3 becomes available.  Hell, in three years LeBron might become a free agent again, and if we&#8217;ve got a decent non-aging core, maybe THEN he&#8217;d come.</p>
<p>Yup, you heard it here first, start the campaign: LeBron in 2013.  He&#8217;ll still only be 28 then.</p>
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		<title>By: Neil</title>
		<link>http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/2010/05/17/is-joe-johnson-worth-a-max-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-998</link>
		<dc:creator>Neil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 15:13:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/?p=1015#comment-998</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s funny that you mention Ginobli. A month ago (much before the Cavs collapsed)I was pretty sure we had zero chance to get Lebron, and thought the best and most feasible scenario was actually to re-sign David Lee and get two veterans for short term deals. 
I had Ginobli and a Marcus Camby as making the most sense. I didn&#039;t think Ginobli will command more than  a 7 mill contract in a team other than the Spurs (due to his age and health track record) and he could have provided the type of playmaking from the wing we desperately needed, while not committing ourselves to a long term investment such as Joe Johnson. 
If I was Donnie, and it looks like we will not get any max player, I would actually monitor the situation with Ray Allen. With him off the cap, the Celtics can actually get younger while replacing him with a legitimate 4th option (Joe Johnson here would actually make sense). At his age, Allen won&#039;t be that expensive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s funny that you mention Ginobli. A month ago (much before the Cavs collapsed)I was pretty sure we had zero chance to get Lebron, and thought the best and most feasible scenario was actually to re-sign David Lee and get two veterans for short term deals.<br />
I had Ginobli and a Marcus Camby as making the most sense. I didn&#8217;t think Ginobli will command more than  a 7 mill contract in a team other than the Spurs (due to his age and health track record) and he could have provided the type of playmaking from the wing we desperately needed, while not committing ourselves to a long term investment such as Joe Johnson.<br />
If I was Donnie, and it looks like we will not get any max player, I would actually monitor the situation with Ray Allen. With him off the cap, the Celtics can actually get younger while replacing him with a legitimate 4th option (Joe Johnson here would actually make sense). At his age, Allen won&#8217;t be that expensive.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex David, aka Short White Boy</title>
		<link>http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/2010/05/17/is-joe-johnson-worth-a-max-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-994</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex David, aka Short White Boy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 22:20:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/?p=1015#comment-994</guid>
		<description>Kris,

I recently read that Joe&#039;s a small town guy so he ain&#039;t a big fan of coming to New York.  That said, even if he&#039;s not a feasible part of NY&#039;s future, the question still remains for Atlanta/Miami/whoever as to how much he&#039;s worth.  Two other potentially intriguing factors:
1. Tons of teams have cap space, so on one hand that could drive UP his price because teams won&#039;t want to end up empty-handed.
However, on the other hand:
2. Teams know that there will be a new collective bargaining agreement (CBA) after this season which should be much more favorable to management.  Will they hesitate to overspend now, knowing that they&#039;ll get much better deals from here on out?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kris,</p>
<p>I recently read that Joe&#8217;s a small town guy so he ain&#8217;t a big fan of coming to New York.  That said, even if he&#8217;s not a feasible part of NY&#8217;s future, the question still remains for Atlanta/Miami/whoever as to how much he&#8217;s worth.  Two other potentially intriguing factors:<br />
1. Tons of teams have cap space, so on one hand that could drive UP his price because teams won&#8217;t want to end up empty-handed.<br />
However, on the other hand:<br />
2. Teams know that there will be a new collective bargaining agreement (CBA) after this season which should be much more favorable to management.  Will they hesitate to overspend now, knowing that they&#8217;ll get much better deals from here on out?</p>
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		<title>By: Avery Johnson to Receive first Hawks Interview, and Other News and Notes &#124; Soaring Down South &#124; An Atlanta Hawks blog</title>
		<link>http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/2010/05/17/is-joe-johnson-worth-a-max-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-991</link>
		<dc:creator>Avery Johnson to Receive first Hawks Interview, and Other News and Notes &#124; Soaring Down South &#124; An Atlanta Hawks blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 11:58:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/?p=1015#comment-991</guid>
		<description>[...] FanSided&#8217;s New York Knicks Blog Buckets over Broadway asks the question &#8220;Is Joe Johnson worth a Max Deal&#8221;?    Share this post: [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] FanSided&#8217;s New York Knicks Blog Buckets over Broadway asks the question &#8220;Is Joe Johnson worth a Max Deal&#8221;?    Share this post: [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Kris Willis</title>
		<link>http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/2010/05/17/is-joe-johnson-worth-a-max-deal/comment-page-1/#comment-989</link>
		<dc:creator>Kris Willis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 11:14:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bucketsoverbroadway.com/?p=1015#comment-989</guid>
		<description>Good write up! I think you are all over this one and I can honestly say I don&#039;t know how it will play out. I really expect the Hawks to offer him more than anyone else but at the same time I am not sure that is what they should do either.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good write up! I think you are all over this one and I can honestly say I don&#8217;t know how it will play out. I really expect the Hawks to offer him more than anyone else but at the same time I am not sure that is what they should do either.</p>
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